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Post by viriss on Dec 27, 2022 3:40:13 GMT
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Post by emberfire17 on Dec 27, 2022 23:30:17 GMT
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moweda
3/3 Beast
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star_silver.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star_silver.png)
Posts: 164
Favorite Card: Psychic Vortex
Color Alignment: Blue, Black, Red
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Post by moweda on Dec 30, 2022 19:25:46 GMT
Phyrexian Extractor ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521673390/PB.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521673390/PB.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521673390/PB.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521673390/PB.gif) Legendary Artifact ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/rare.gif) Whenever an artifact you control leaves the battlefield, you may pay ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521673390/PB.gif) . If you do, create a Blood token and put a charge counter on ~. ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521673390/PB.gif) , ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/T.gif) , Remove X charge counters from ~: Return target creature card with mana value X from your graveyard to the battlefield. Blood from stone.
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pernicious
8/8 Octopus
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star_yellow.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star_yellow.png)
Posts: 440
Favorite Card: Mistmeadow Skulk
Favorite Set: Shadowmoor block
Color Alignment: Red
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Post by pernicious on Jan 2, 2023 20:19:50 GMT
Idea - You forgot to add "Aura" to the card's types. I think it's a rather interesting design; it's well balanced and I like its sinister flavor. It would be a perfect fit for the Shadows over Innistrad block.
Flo00 - Nice design. I might want to raise its cost by 1, or to change the first ability to "Whenever a nontoken creature dies..." due to the potential of its lifegain effect (Imagine how many charge counters it could get during an EDH game)
viriss - Mechanically, I think it's perfect; but I would have changed the second ability to "Whenever enchanted creature deals combat damage, put a charge counter on it." to give a more direct feeling of bloodlust, and maybe I'd also reduce the rarity down to uncommon.
emberfire17 - Nice creature, I would only change the wording of the second ability to "Other Vampires you control get +X/+X until end of turn, where X is the number of charge counters on Artificial Bloodsucker.", and I'd debuff it by making the activated ability's cost " ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/B.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/B.gif) , ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/T.gif) ".
moweda - Welcome to the forums. That's a powerful artifact, I'd maybe raise its rarity up to mythic. It's an interesting design, with a good choice of flavor text. I wish that it could interact more with the Blood tokens, for example, by dividing the first ability in: "Whenever an artifact you control leaves the battlefield, you may pay ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521673390/PB.gif) . If you do, create a Blood token." and "Sacrifice a Blood token: Put a charge counter on Phyrexian Extractor."
The winner is Idea! With viriss and moweda as runnerups.
Happy new year, everybody!
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Post by Idea on Jan 3, 2023 0:57:58 GMT
LIMIT #35: Even Steven: Your card's CMC is even. LIMIT #49: Mix it up: Your card has an off-colour ability. (Thanks, lordofthetoasters!)And for our new addition: Limit #189 Rules? I am the Rules!: Your card has a " rest of the game" effect (Thanks, Idea!)
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Post by kefke on Jan 3, 2023 17:48:20 GMT
What do you suppose it would look like if Green got an Armageddon? I think it might look like this. Edit: Here's a quote from Mark Rosewater, to explain how this is an off-color ability.
[Source 1] [Source 2]
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Post by Flo00 on Jan 3, 2023 18:08:29 GMT
Ghastly Strike ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/B.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/B.gif) Instant ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/rare.gif) Destroy target attacking creature. If Ghastly Strike was cast for its flashback cost, for the rest of the game, creatures can’t attack you unless their controller pays ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521554622/1.gif) for each creature they control that’s attacking you. Flashback ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555244/4.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/W.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/W.gif) EDIT: Changed it from tapped to attacking creature. I hope this is sufficiently off-color.
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Post by Flo00 on Jan 3, 2023 18:10:47 GMT
kefke looks like we have very different Idea s of what an off-color ability is.
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Post by kefke on Jan 3, 2023 22:00:23 GMT
kefke looks like we have very different Idea s of what an off-color ability is. I suppose I should have put an explanation in the post. While turning things into Forests still feels Green (and yeah, Green has done it before), land changers are typically in Blue's wheelhouse. In both the 2017 and 2021 editions of his "Mechanical Color Pie" articles, MaRo lists changing lands into other lands as something Magic doesn't really "do" anymore, but which is Primary in Blue when it is done. So I'd consider it an off-colour ability in modern environments, even if it might have been something that all colours got a little of in the past.
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Post by vizionarius on Jan 3, 2023 22:04:14 GMT
kefke looks like we have very different Idea s of what an off-color ability is. I suppose I should have put an explanation in the post. While turning things into Forests still feels Green (and yeah, Green has done it before), land changers are typically in Blue's wheelhouse. In both the 2017 and 2021 editions of his "Mechanical Color Pie" articles, MaRo lists changing lands into other lands as something Magic doesn't really "do" anymore, but which is Primary in Blue when it is done. So I'd consider it an off-colour ability in modern environments, even if it might have been something that all colours got a little of in the past.
I think the reference was more about a totally different understanding of what "off color ability" means. They took it as an ability that has a color that's not of the card's color. You took it as an ability in a color that that color doesn't usually do.
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Post by kefke on Jan 3, 2023 22:07:50 GMT
I suppose I should have put an explanation in the post. While turning things into Forests still feels Green (and yeah, Green has done it before), land changers are typically in Blue's wheelhouse. In both the 2017 and 2021 editions of his "Mechanical Color Pie" articles, MaRo lists changing lands into other lands as something Magic doesn't really "do" anymore, but which is Primary in Blue when it is done. So I'd consider it an off-colour ability in modern environments, even if it might have been something that all colours got a little of in the past.
I think the reference was more about a totally different understanding of what "off color ability" means. They took it as an ability that has a color that's not of the card's color. You took it as an ability in a color that that color doesn't usually do. Oh. I see what you/they mean now. Hmm...
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Post by Idea on Jan 3, 2023 22:38:01 GMT
I will admit I did not realize what the misunderstanding here was at first but now I do. I tried looking up the original but unfortunately it was one of the slots that was in the old forums so I'm not sure quite how to find it or how much time and effort that would take. So, at risk of maybe not being the original intent, I will interpret the slot's requirements are the way I typically see the phrase "off-color ability" being used which is more in line with kefke 's interpretation (an ability which is outside of the mechanical themes of that card's color). Just to put everything in clear plates.
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Post by vizionarius on Jan 4, 2023 0:13:00 GMT
![](https://imgur.com/vSs4KWm.jpg) While flipping is definitely a ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/R.gif) thing, countering spells isn't.
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Post by Flo00 on Jan 4, 2023 9:59:41 GMT
I will admit I did not realize what the misunderstanding here was at first but now I do. I tried looking up the original but unfortunately it was one of the slots that was in the old forums so I'm not sure quite how to find it or how much time and effort that would take. So, at risk of maybe not being the original intent, I will interpret the slot's requirements are the way I typically see the phrase "off-color ability" being used which is more in line with kefke 's interpretation (an ability which is outside of the mechanical themes of that card's color). Just to put everything in clear plates. In this case, I'll try to come up with something new soon. By the way, the original wasn't that hard to find: klick me!
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Post by Idea on Jan 4, 2023 11:07:17 GMT
I will admit I did not realize what the misunderstanding here was at first but now I do. I tried looking up the original but unfortunately it was one of the slots that was in the old forums so I'm not sure quite how to find it or how much time and effort that would take. So, at risk of maybe not being the original intent, I will interpret the slot's requirements are the way I typically see the phrase "off-color ability" being used which is more in line with kefke 's interpretation (an ability which is outside of the mechanical themes of that card's color). Just to put everything in clear plates. In this case, I'll try to come up with something new soon. By the way, the original wasn't that hard to find: klick me!It does appear you were right, looking at that thread. Since I already stated I would judge it how I said I would though and there’s been more entries since then, I think it will be fairer to continue as I stated. That being said, thank you for the link and my apologies for the trouble. I’ll keep this in mind for the future.
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Post by viriss on Jan 4, 2023 19:00:34 GMT
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Post by melono on Jan 5, 2023 17:35:54 GMT
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Post by collex on Jan 6, 2023 3:47:30 GMT
Here is my entry. The ability is a riff on Enduring Angel, so I think that meets the off-color requirement? Let me know if it doesn't. ![Everlasting Portrait](https://i.imgur.com/SNcxvuU.png)
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pernicious
8/8 Octopus
![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star_yellow.png) ![*](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/stars/star_yellow.png)
Posts: 440
Favorite Card: Mistmeadow Skulk
Favorite Set: Shadowmoor block
Color Alignment: Red
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Post by pernicious on Jan 6, 2023 8:16:37 GMT
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Post by twintania on Jan 8, 2023 20:53:13 GMT
![](https://imgur.com/CmR6JnZ.png) Possessed by Phoenix is a spell of Mokou Fujiwara from Touhou Project. I love Reach for the Moon, Immortal Smoke, her theme song, since I feel a strong taste of a mystic immortal living through and suffering from an eternal time from it and the music depicts her character.
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Post by Idea on Jan 10, 2023 18:32:56 GMT
Review coming tomorrow!
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Post by Idea on Jan 12, 2023 3:16:19 GMT
kefke{Spoiler}Simple design, I guess it's an off-color ability with that many sources backing it up. The one thing about this card though is the wording feels kind of off. While I understand it is for the challenge the fact is I'm fairly certain this kind of effect would typically just be worded as "lands with overgrowth counters are forests" or "those lands are forests as long as they have overgrowth counters on them". If this was some pre-existing type of counter or if it affected lands even after losing the counter/leaving the battlefield it might make more sense, but neither of them seems to be the case and the latter doesn't give you any means to track the lands as they move between areas. Flo00: {Spoiler}Eh I'll accept it (for the off-color matter). Black I feel is probably the hardest to really make off-color because black is kind of the "do it all for the right price" color. Rest of the game effect may be a little strong for the cost and there seems to be some mechanic/flavor disconnect, but other than that, solid design. vizionarius{Spoiler}That devil is playing a dangerous game attacking so often when its so dangerous to let it hit. I mean, even if we skew the odds to one third, that's a free Mana Leak on the opponent every third turn. A rest of the game effect is like an emblem, you can't interact with it and its always there, so I think it either needs to be something smaller or something a bit harder to trigger. Not to mention the fact that you may not have intended this, but this effect seems to stack (or at least I am not aware of any rule that would prevent the same effect worded like this from being applied onto a player multiple times), which according to ward rules would mean several instances of coin flipping each potentially triggering a mana leak. I'm not sure if a non-red effect within flipping randomness isn't still red, but grey areas get a pass. Overall the card has some clever ideas in it, but I think it could be use being toned down a bit. viriss{Spoiler}An element of randomness is a very interesting way to try to balance a rest of the game effect, particularly one so specific. I'm not sure if it wouldn't have been better to let you choose though, as otherwise the strategic value of a card like is immensely diminished to the point where I have trouble seeing how someone could really take advantage of the effect at all without potentially screwing themselves over. melono{Spoiler}First of all, I want to commend you for trying to make a mechanic like epic work. I think you come pretty close to striking an excellent balance of choice and simplicity in an effect for that mechanic, which is one the main requirements I would say would be needed to make this mechanic work and be fun. Picking a creature from your graveyard while milling yourself so fast is a risky strategy, but one which gets the Johny in me really brainstorming about potential ways to take advantage of it when you're restricted otherwise.
A major downside for this card however, is that it also worsens some aspects of epic. It immediately puts you on a countdown while accelerating how fast it can be played. And while it may seem like has synergy with self-milling or other graveyard decks, those decks require further casting. collex{Spoiler}Neat, a Dorian Gray reference! I like how you used the rest of the game effect on a negative side for you, thematically balancing the type of effect this was - which healed and saved you from death. I'm not sure the point of that last sentence since presumably it would only come into effect after you sacrificed it? But maybe I'm just misunderstanding something. pernicious{Spoiler}It's hard to judge this card. At first glance I am pretty appalled. We're talking about something you can't block with creatures (with walls you can, but I doubt many decks actually run any) AND you can't target to interact with, leaving essentially AOE as your only option, then on top of it, this card has a very powerful rest of the game effect that triggers upon hitting the opponent. It does regulate itself a bit by only letting you have one of it in the battlefield at a time, and because scry is a specific action that while not exactly uncommon is not something many strategies heavily rely on or even necessarily employ. On the other hand, stuff like Invisible Stalker and Slippery Scoundrel exist, so considering your card costs at least one more colored mana... But then, I would rate that rest of the game effect as definitely higher than one or two mana, so I still think this card is a bit undercosted, if not needing a bit more weaknesses. twintania{Spoiler}This is definitely a super interesting effect, burning your opponent to protect yourself. That being said, I feel the protection effect and required damage are skewed in quite the wrong direction here, if there should be any skew at all. ANY damage triggers it, and each 1 damage you deal can absorb a boatload of damage in turn. Even if you lose the counters each turn, building up a sizeable amount of them shouldn't be that hard. I also think the wording in the first sentence is a bit ambiguous on whether it is exiling a card that already has a counter on it, or if its putting a counter on a card it is exiling. I presume it is the later because of the context of the card, but where possible it should be made clear on the sentence itself. Aside from that, there is also the issue I talked about with kefke 's submission, that the wording for this kind of effect (referring to the last effect specifically) is not typically "for the rest of the game", more like "as long as it has a x counter, you may remove that counter to cast a copy of it" or something along those lines. Winner {Spoiler}I think by far the best design was collex 's , so I'm giving them the win! Runner up is twintania for a really interesting effect.
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Post by vizionarius on Jan 12, 2023 8:57:44 GMT
Overall the card has some clever ideas in it, but I think it could be use being toned down a bit. Thanks! Glad you liked some of the design. I actually think the card is a little too weak to actually see much play, but maybe I'm missing something. I think it's too slow for Standard, and there is so much hate in Commander that I'd be surprised if it saw the next turn to swing (or if given haste, still can just be chumped). But you do make a good point on it hitting a player multiple times would keep making the player flip more coins (on the first spell). That indeed was an unintended effect. I'd likely just make the only change of "Whenever ~ deals combat damage to a player, if it's the first time it dealt damage to that player this game, for the rest of the game..." to make it feel better in the off chance it does actually hits. After playtest, the ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555244/3.gif) might change to a ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521554622/2.gif) . Anyway, looking forward to the next challenge! This one was a fun one! ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png)
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Post by Idea on Jan 12, 2023 10:01:21 GMT
Overall the card has some clever ideas in it, but I think it could be use being toned down a bit. Thanks! Glad you liked some of the design. I actually think the card is a little too weak to actually see much play, but maybe I'm missing something. I think it's too slow for Standard, and there is so much hate in Commander that I'd be surprised if it saw the next turn to swing (or if given haste, still can just be chumped). But you do make a good point on it hitting a player multiple times would keep making the player flip more coins (on the first spell). That indeed was an unintended effect. I'd likely just make the only change of "Whenever ~ deals combat damage to a player, if it's the first time it dealt damage to that player this game, for the rest of the game..." to make it feel better in the off chance it does actually hits. After playtest, the ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555244/3.gif) " style="max-width:100%;"] might change to a ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521554622/2.gif) " style="max-width:100%;"]. Anyway, looking forward to the next challenge! This one was a fun one! ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) One thing I will mention is when I say I think a card may be too strong or weak or that it may be unbalanced, I am mostly talking in a vacuum. I will compare it to other cards I never really have any kind of format in mind, and especially not any particular meta.
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Post by vizionarius on Jan 12, 2023 10:11:20 GMT
Fair enough. Essentially I think there are better cards for 4 mana that will have a larger game impact. My general criteria for balance is "Would I play something else in the type of deck this would go into, or would it be a tough decision to cut this for something else." That's not to say it can't be strong. But thanks for the clarification.
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Post by Daij_Djan on Jan 12, 2023 15:03:02 GMT
Just for the record (I saw the confusion too late for this challenge to respond so I decided to not cause any more confusion and wait for this round to end ![;)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/wink.png) ), LIMIT #49 indeed refers to cards like the Battlemages - those have "offcolor" abilities. The other interpretation, "out of color" abilities, are generally referred to as color pie bends or breaks.
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Post by Flo00 on Jan 13, 2023 19:32:18 GMT
Eh I'll accept it (for the off-color matter). Black I feel is probably the hardest to really make off-color because black is kind of the "do it all for the right price" color. Rest of the game effect may be a little strong for the cost and there seems to be some mechanic/flavor disconnect, but other than that, solid design. For the flavour I meant to go with a combination of something like Assassin's Strike and Ghostly Prison. A ghost striking someone down but also chaining or imprisoning your opponent in the process.
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Post by collex on Jan 14, 2023 1:29:58 GMT
Thank you for the win Idea! For the last sentence, I admit I only haf-understand it myself. I took it from Enduring Angel. From what I gather, It's a failsafe to make someone doesn't break the card by finding an obscure rule interaction in eternal formats that would allow you to trigger the ability but also save the card. But I'm not sure how one could do this, so there might be no way. Alright, for the next challenge, the limits are: LIMIT #121: Can you paint with all the colors of the wind? Your card encourages you to play a 5-color deck! (Thanks, gateways7!) LIMIT #9: Ambiguity: Your card either counters spells or puts counters on permanents. LIMIT #190: 700 million years in the making: Your card has a prehistoric flavour (dinosaurs, cavemen, megafauna, primordial soup, etc.) (Thanks, collex!) I hope I did this right - it's my first time winning this challenge! I can'T wait to see what you've cooked up!
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Post by Flo00 on Jan 14, 2023 2:10:29 GMT
Giant Ants ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555244/3.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/R.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/R.gif) Creature - Insect ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/uncommon.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/T.gif) , Exile a land you control: Destroy target land. Giant Ants gets +1/+1 for each basic land type among cards exiled with it. 3/3 {I'm not happy with this}Rainbow Egg ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555244/X.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521554622/1.gif) ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/G.gif) Creature - Egg ![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/uncommon.gif) Sunburst (This enters the battlefield with a +1/+1 counter on it for each color of mana spent to cast it.)![](http://res.cloudinary.com/daijdjan/image/upload/v1521555837/T.gif) , Remove a +1/+1 counter from Rainbow Egg: Add one mana of any color. When Rainbow Egg dies, create a 0/0 green Dinosaur creature token and put all +1/+1 counters Rainbow Egg had onto it. 0/0
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Post by Idea on Jan 14, 2023 2:49:08 GMT
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