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Post by Tesagk on Jul 31, 2018 14:49:16 GMT
I may not be able to use the mechanic, because it's too wordy, but I figured I'd see if any of you could help me preserve its general structure while making it less complicated. At the moment, I've chosen: Thanks to Reddit user Aryatho: {Possibles} ( gamma3 offered this up) (from Reddit, Niniju offered): (from Reddit, aryatho offered): |
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Post by gamma3 on Jul 31, 2018 18:54:49 GMT
Hm, this is tough. Maybe:
Ritual (Each creature you sacrifice while casting this spell pays mana equal to its casting cost.)
I feel like this keeps the general idea, but idk if it works within the rules of the game.
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Post by Tesagk on Jul 31, 2018 18:55:37 GMT
I'll share it on Reddit as well. I like it, if this works.
Redditor suggested: Ritual (Your creatures can help cast this spell. Each creature you sacrifice while casting this spell pays for 1 or one mana of that creature's color.)
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Post by Tesagk on Jul 31, 2018 23:07:40 GMT
Right now, this is what I have: Thanks to Reddit user Aryatho: |
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Aug 1, 2018 6:04:01 GMT
Tesagk ) This already exists, for the most part, in a more balanced form. Look up Offering.
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 1, 2018 6:15:41 GMT
Tesagk ) This already exists, for the most part, in a more balanced form. Look up Offering. More balanced than?  |
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Aug 1, 2018 6:23:54 GMT
Tegask ) Yes.
For one, Offering only allows you to sac one creature, and it counts it against the creature's casting cost, making it less likely to get a creature for "free" or to bin a creature you don't want to get exiled to bring it back with a Phyrexian Reclamation. For two, Offering includes Flash as part and parcel.
See Patron of the Akki for an example of Offering in action. I honestly think Offering is a good ability that needs more love from Wizards. |
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 1, 2018 10:25:31 GMT
Tegask ) Yes.
For one, Offering only allows you to sac one creature, and it counts it against the creature's casting cost, making it less likely to get a creature for "free" or to bin a creature you don't want to get exiled to bring it back with a Phyrexian Reclamation. For two, Offering includes Flash as part and parcel.
See Patron of the Akki for an example of Offering in action. I honestly think Offering is a good ability that needs more love from Wizards. I'm not sure whether or not we're understanding the intent of the keyword on the same page. There's no chance of getting a creature for "free" with the keyword I've proposed? Ritual isn't a keyword intended for creatures. However, even if a creature did end up having Ritual slapped on it, you'd need to sacrifice enough creatures worth of mana costs in order to get the new creature out. Offering is fine and all and I might be able to find uses for it in the set, but it's not doing the same things that Ritual is doing. Hence confusion. |
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SirnightNano
1/1 Squirrel
Posts: 92
Favorite Card: Thopter Spy Network
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red
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Post by SirnightNano on Aug 1, 2018 11:15:53 GMT
Take a look at Wretched Gryff for a very similar effect using SOI's Emerge. Your Ritual keyword is essentially the same thing |
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 1, 2018 12:43:37 GMT
Take a look at Wretched Gryff for a very similar effect using SOI's Emerge. Your Ritual keyword is essentially the same thing Yes, after taking some advice from someone on the Reddit forums, I modeled Ritual to be similar to emerge. However, stylistically it's a different concept. Mechanically... I could use emerge, though mine does all mana cost (not converted) and I think it has an interesting place within the set. |
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 1, 2018 14:19:38 GMT
I do appreciate the feedback. As far as I'm concerned, this keyword has been figured out. But if there are still issues with the new one I've landed on, feel free to continue discussing it here.
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Aug 2, 2018 0:58:52 GMT
Tegask ) Yes.
For one, Offering only allows you to sac one creature, and it counts it against the creature's casting cost, making it less likely to get a creature for "free" or to bin a creature you don't want to get exiled to bring it back with a Phyrexian Reclamation. For two, Offering includes Flash as part and parcel.
See Patron of the Akki for an example of Offering in action. I honestly think Offering is a good ability that needs more love from Wizards. I'm not sure whether or not we're understanding the intent of the keyword on the same page. There's no chance of getting a creature for "free" with the keyword I've proposed? Ritual isn't a keyword intended for creatures. However, even if a creature did end up having Ritual slapped on it, you'd need to sacrifice enough creatures worth of mana costs in order to get the new creature out. Offering is fine and all and I might be able to find uses for it in the set, but it's not doing the same things that Ritual is doing. Hence confusion.
You can sac any number of creatures with mana costs to satisfy Ritual as written. The reason "free" is in quotes is because you could, say, get rid of a bunch of early-game creatures gathering dust to defray or eliminate the mana cost of a much more worthwhile critter, or even yoink and sac if you're playing the right colours. This is why Offering only allows one creature to be sacrificed, and why the Patrons' mana costs are as high as they are.
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 2, 2018 1:43:16 GMT
Gotcha. So you're saying I should require at least one sacrifice for the ritual?
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SirnightNano
1/1 Squirrel
Posts: 92
Favorite Card: Thopter Spy Network
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red
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Post by SirnightNano on Aug 2, 2018 9:04:01 GMT
Rather than requiring "at least one" it should be "exactly one". Using the total mana cost of a spell is problematic too, since that will have to work in discounts and taxes that might be altering the cost, and it's awkward to be playing a deck that rewards you for your spells being taxed.
et voila, you made Emerge. For sorceries.
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 2, 2018 10:41:33 GMT
Rather than requiring "at least one" it should be "exactly one". Using the total mana cost of a spell is problematic too, since that will have to work in discounts and taxes that might be altering the cost, and it's awkward to be playing a deck that rewards you for your spells being taxed.
et voila, you made Emerge. For sorceries.
Well, that may have to be the case for simplicity's sake. However, the idea was that you could sacrifice multiple creatures because, in my head, rituals require more than one participant. Is "Emerge for sorceries/instants" interesting enough to be worth pursuing? |
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Post by voltaic-qui on Aug 2, 2018 16:30:11 GMT
Rather than requiring "at least one" it should be "exactly one". Using the total mana cost of a spell is problematic too, since that will have to work in discounts and taxes that might be altering the cost, and it's awkward to be playing a deck that rewards you for your spells being taxed.
et voila, you made Emerge. For sorceries.
Well, that may have to be the case for simplicity's sake. However, the idea was that you could sacrifice multiple creatures because, in my head, rituals require more than one participant. Is "Emerge for sorceries/instants" interesting enough to be worth pursuing? IMO yes - note that a lot of emerge cards in EMN had flash because it plays really well (opponent tosses a kill spell at a bomb, you respond by sacking it to cast an emerge spell) |
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 2, 2018 16:43:13 GMT
Well, that may have to be the case for simplicity's sake. However, the idea was that you could sacrifice multiple creatures because, in my head, rituals require more than one participant. Is "Emerge for sorceries/instants" interesting enough to be worth pursuing? IMO yes - note that a lot of emerge cards in EMN had flash because it plays really well (opponent tosses a kill spell at a bomb, you respond by sacking it to cast an emerge spell) The big question after that is: should I limit it to sorcery speed? Traditionally, rituals take time. However, some of the sorcery cards that get Ritual could end up being stupidly strong with an instant-speed way to cast them. |
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Aug 2, 2018 20:28:05 GMT
FWIW, I'm using a Ritual keyword culled from the Keywords thread, and how it works is that all rituals are instants - but if you pay the ritual cost, it's instead cast as a sorcery and gains additional effects.
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Post by Tesagk on Aug 2, 2018 22:32:09 GMT
FWIW, I'm using a Ritual keyword culled from the Keywords thread, and how it works is that all rituals are instants - but if you pay the ritual cost, it's instead cast as a sorcery and gains additional effects. Yeah, I think I'm going to make it both still, but have ritual be sorcery-speed. Not sure if I'll end up subtyping it though, it's something I considered. It's a fun concept to play with. |
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