Schwa77
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 108
Favorite Card: Gishath, Sun's Avatar
Favorite Set: Ixalan
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by Schwa77 on Mar 4, 2020 1:29:50 GMT
I've always been a huge fan of Ixalan, and wanted to try and design a draft cube themed around one of the major factions (Dinosaurs, Pirates, Merfolk, Vampires), and decided to focus on Pirates with a secondary focus on Merfolk as one of the main factions. Introducing Krakonos! Krakonos is a plane of endless ocean spotted with islands. Pirates run rampant across the endless seas, pillaging the wreckage of fallen civilizations for precious treasures. Art by Stayinwonderland, DeviantArt
I plan to split the set into 5 factions based on Shards of Alara. Each faction is hopefully going to have it's own signature mechanic, though two will likely share one and utilize it differently (more on that later). The five factions currently are: - Red - Green - White: Human Pirates, Explorers, Scouts
- Black - Red - Green: Non-Human (Goblin, Orc, etc) Pirates, Mercenaries, Bounty Hunters
- Blue - Black - Red: Merfolk, Sea Monsters
- White - Blue - Black: Ghost Ships, Zombie/Skeleton Pirates
- White - Blue - Green: Ships, Pilots
(Disclaimer: all 5 colors will have ships since they're kinda a pivotal part of piracy, but the White-Blue-Green faction will be able to use them a lot better)
Current New Mechanics (subject to change)
- Plunder - Whenever this creature deals combat damage to a player, create a Treasure token (primary in WRG and BRG)
- Voyage X - Exile this permanent and X other creatures. Place X time counters on them. They gain suspend. (primary in WUG). Voyage will probably only appear on Vehicles and every card with Voyage will have a "When CARDNAME enters the battlefield, [take action]" ability
- More to come in the future
Yes, I know Valiant Buccaneer doesn't work, I just needed an example of Plunder. And now, some things I need help with: - Can you think of any meaningful way to include artifact creatures in the set? I'm happy to bend the laws of reality (after all, the game is called Magic), so maybe some Automaton Pirates could see introduction.
- Ideas on separate mechanics the Ghost Ship and Merfolk shards?
- Not necessarily related to Krakonos, but how do I determine rarity on cards? That's one thing I've always been terrible at.
- What do you want to see from Krakonos in the future? Currently the set is in a very early stage (only a few cards done, mostly just planning) so this is the perfect time to work some ideas out.
I've got some cool ideas for the future of this project, and I hope you guys are looking forward to it!
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jverse
3/3 Beast
Posts: 195
Favorite Card: Animar, Soul of Elements
Favorite Set: Shadowmoor
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by jverse on Mar 4, 2020 5:34:17 GMT
This is a cool concept. Pirates have plenty of uncharted territory to explore in Magic. I also really like the idea of non-human pirates, and that color shard is perfect for it. Plunder is a good idea and makes a lot of sense, but it's a mechanic within a mechanic, which I don't think ever happens. Instead, you might just make a lot of creatures with that ability and not keyword it. Unfortunately that means you would need another mechanic for that colour combo, but isn't treasure good enough, or are you using treasure across all the factions? Voyage has the same problem. I suggest you try to invent something that doesn't involve suspend. You might consider using something similar to adventures from Eldraine, or just use adventure itself. Cajun just recently finished the template for it on the forums. If the idea is for a bunch of ships and creatures to go on a journey together and then come back and do something, that pretty much describes adventures. The only difference is that vehicles aren't involved, and it's on an individual card basis. There's definitely some potential here, though. As for the other shards that still need mechanics, I have a few ideas. Pirates and sailors are very superstitious and full of tales of ghosts and monsters and other things lurking on the high seas. I suggest you lean into that and utilize some type of fear mechanic for the ghost ships. Don't use fear, obviously, as its considered obsolete, but maybe it could be something similar like Terror (This creature can't be blocked by Pirates). It's very simple and has good synergy with a lot of other mechanics, and it's also potentially very powerful. Another version could be something like Terror (Whenever this creature attacks, return target creature defending player controls to its owner's hand). That communicates the idea of Pirates running in fear as a ghost approaches. It's very strong so you'd have to use this sparingly, or put some kind of limitation on it (based on creature power, give it an activation of some kind, whatever). For the merfolk, I'm less confident, but merfolk, from ancient times at least, have almost always been nefarious. Some sort of mechanic involving forced attacks on you and then granting you some kind of benefit would make a lot of flavor sense. For instance, Lure COST (Target creature must attack you or a planeswalker you control this turn if able. Destroy it at the end of combat. Activate this ability only at the beginning of combat during an opponent's turn.) There's probably a better way to word this, and possibly a cleaner execution, but the basic idea is an irresistible siren or merfolk luring unwary sailors to their doom. Merfolk tend to be a small tribe that relies on numbers rather than size and feature a lot of tokens or counters, so you might be able to use that to your advantage too. Drown COST (Target tapped creature gets -1/-1 for each Merfolk you control). I dunno, just brainstorming over here... For rarities, You let the card complexity tell you what rarity they are. Commons get basic stuff done, but don't usually feature anything new, complicated, or splashy. Uncommons are also mainly functional, but can be quite a bit more complex and have multiple lines of text. Rares help you win games. Mythics, as Mark Rosewater puts it, just win. You want every Mythic to feel unique and memorable. If you just start creating a bunch of cards, though, you're going to make tons of cool and powerful designs and end up with just piles of rares and mythic rares. In order to keep things under control, I suggest restricting yourself to a card skeleton and filling it in with the rarities and card types you need. I highly recommended going through these articles from the Nuts and Bolts series that describe how to create a standard Magic set in detail. The design skeleton will help you figure out what you need and the numbers of each card type at each rarity. Then you can begin your designs and it will really help you streamline the process. If you have too many cool designs that you want in the set but no space for them (as I often do), just put them aside for now and create a second set in the same block. Then you have two or more awesome sets to draft from, and they will naturally work together because they began as one set! On another note... You are industrious aren't you! How many sets are you working on right now exactly!?
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Post by fluffydeathbringer on Mar 4, 2020 13:39:51 GMT
so even at 1, voyage 1) kneecaps the ability of vehicles to attack and 2) is gonna have to have real good effects to be worth losing a blocker. and at voyage 2 it is practically never going to be worth it because of how the keyword scales, especially in cube where you don't have redundancies. honestly just use crew and have triggered abilities go off that, possibly with mana costs
also scouting vessel in particular is super not worth picking, because at the time you can voyage with it (or even cast it), if you're playing ramp, you don't need rampers and should be casting your payoffs. and on its own, a 3/6 vanilla that you need other creatures to even attack with is not a payoff
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Post by Lady Mapi on Mar 4, 2020 15:25:04 GMT
First off, ignore rarities if you're making a cube - cubes are supposed to generally consist of cards of equal power, since all of the cards are singletons. Since the primary purpose of rarities is to control how often a card shows up when cracking open packs, it's irrelevant for cubing. In any case, I have to disagree with fluffydeathbringer - Voyage is a fantastic mechanic, but maybe not for the reason you intended. It's fantastic because it acts as temporary creature removal. In Green. (Notice how it does not specify creatures you control). However, Scout Ship is pretty overcosted for what it is - I'd mark it down to maybe , personally? --- For your Esper Ghosts and Grixis Merfolk factions... what kind of playstyle do you want them to have? It's kinda pointless to try to come up with solid mechanics if you aren't sure what they'll be used for.
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Schwa77
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 108
Favorite Card: Gishath, Sun's Avatar
Favorite Set: Ixalan
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by Schwa77 on Mar 4, 2020 16:20:32 GMT
jverse Marvel the Gathering is temporarily put on hold. I was getting burnt out with that project and wanted to try my hand at something new. I'm probably going to keep Plunder since Treasure will show up in all 5 factions, just primarily the 2 pirate-centric ones. It feels like I should keyword it since it will be a primary ability of the faction instead of writing it out on every card. I like the idea of Terror as a keyword, but I agree it needs more refinement, since it would be way too overpowered to attack with a ton of Terror creatures and return every creature to the hand. Maybe "when this creature attacks, tap target creature blocking player controls" to represent the pirates cowering in fear? I think Lure works better as an ability than a keyword since it will be less common, but Drown definitely works. I debated something called "Dive" as a modification to Islandwalk, but it didn't feel quite right since having just the one didn't seem balanced. Though considering Krakonos is an oceanic plane, I might be able to do something with it. Also, I'm not a huge fan of Adventures as Ships with Voyage since I want the Voyage to be repeatable. I messed around with trying to get repeatable adventures but didn't really like where it ended up. fluffydeathbringer I understand the points on how Voyage is kinda imbalanced (and I'm still trying to figure out how to balance it). I might change it to "Crew this Vehicle. Exile it and all creatures crewing it. Place X time counters on them and they gain suspend) to try and balance it out. Helps flavor-wise as well since then the ship has crew members for a voyage. Lady Mapi Unfortunately, the "exiling any creature" is an oversight on my part, since it's only supposed to be creatures you control. Doesn't make sense that your opponent's creatures would help on an expedition. I might have a few ships that can exile any creatures for Voyage, but it will be mostly those that you control. In terms of Merfolk playstyle, I'd like to have something combining their historical cunning/mischief, combining evasive damage (diving underwater) with some big creatures (sea serpents, leviathans, etc.) I honestly want to try something with face-down cards as a "hidden enemy" kind of theme, again adding to the mischief. In terms of the Undead faction, maybe some way to bring them back from the graveyard, potentially reworking Unearth. It would be nice to have the face-down idea with these as well (ghosts are often invisible and can surprise unsuspecting pirates), but I think that would work a little bit better in the Merfolk faction. Hopefully I've answered any questions you guys had. And thanks for the advice with rarities! An additional question: do you think this set warrants Planeswalkers? I'm debating whether or not they're worth adding since there aren't really any "Pirate Gods" so to speak, but I feel like they've kinda ingrained themselves as a big part of MTG.
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Post by fluffydeathbringer on Mar 4, 2020 19:55:43 GMT
I mean if you wanna add them, add them, it's not more complicated than that
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jverse
3/3 Beast
Posts: 195
Favorite Card: Animar, Soul of Elements
Favorite Set: Shadowmoor
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by jverse on Mar 5, 2020 1:10:21 GMT
I like the idea of tapping a creature when the ghosts attack. Definitely more balanced. It should say "whenever this creature attacks, tap target creature defending player controls." There's no requirement for them to block. This is also far superior to unlockable as it still allows for some interaction.
Plunder is fine as a keyword, but the treasure token is also keyworded and should generally be in the card text. I guess if your treasure tokens have the text on them then you could ignore it elsewhere, especially if players already know what treasures do.
Voyage can work with a change in wording. I see what you mean about it being repeatable. I think it needs a huge payoff though. Or, if you're feeling chaotic, you could have a few cards that make risky voyages that can grant you big rewards or complete failure. Something like a coin flip that would allow your voyagers to return with a bunch of treasure, or all die and go to the graveyard. It could even be a secondary instant or sorcery card that interacts with permanents already voyaging like this. I envision lots of design space around this, and all very flavorful.
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Schwa77
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 108
Favorite Card: Gishath, Sun's Avatar
Favorite Set: Ixalan
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by Schwa77 on Mar 5, 2020 22:14:15 GMT
jverse I fixed it to defending player. Treasure tokens will definitely have the text, so it should be fine in Plunder. I think the idea of failed voyages works a little bit better as sorceries/instants than chance, since it could just end up destroying your card as soon as it enters the battlefield.
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Schwa77
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 108
Favorite Card: Gishath, Sun's Avatar
Favorite Set: Ixalan
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by Schwa77 on Mar 8, 2020 0:58:33 GMT
Between the mixed feedback here and some debates among our design group, we decided to rework Voyage using Adventures. Basically, Voyage lets you play the adventure when the Vehicle is on the battlefield, then standard Adventure rules take over. However, I'm not sure if the mechanic works as currently worded, or will even work in games. Do you think this is a better way to use Voyage, or should we return it to the old one?
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Post by chaospydr on Apr 26, 2020 0:01:09 GMT
Hello,
Just found out about this wonderful application today because I intend on making proxies to play with during the quarantine. I stumbled across your post since I was looking for information on card fonts since I am just crash-testing the application right now. I wanted to make a suggestion about this voyage ability with the adventure rules since it seems that there have been no replies since March. The way the adventure mechanic is worded makes it a requirement to have the card in hand when casting it, since as far as I know, there has been no permanent with the wording, "you may cast this spell" while it is on the battlefield... If I am making sense... Anyway, I would just suggest it being worded similarly to something like exert. It could say something like, "When this vehicle becomes crewed you may send it on a voyage, if you do, return it to your hand and cast its adventure for free." Something to that effect so the "cast this spell" type wording can be worked around. Also, where are the fonts?! I can't find them! Thanks, have a great one.
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