jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 11, 2018 4:21:02 GMT
And, lastly, we have my lands. Most are fairly simple. I'm actually going to provide a little insight in some of them before hand. I have tri color pain lands (provide one color, or one of its two friendlies for 1 damage), what I call "death lands" (provide one color, or one of its two enemies for 1 life), and a cycle of non-basic Basic Lands. They count as the land type, tap for the appropriate mana, but also can tap for an ability in that color's purview.
Buried Hotsprings Land :uncommon: T: Add B to your mana pool. T: Add U or R to your mana pool. Buried Hotsprings deals 1 damage to you.
Burned Woodlands Land :uncommon: T: Add R to your mana pool. T: Add B or G to your mana pool. Burned Woodlands deals 1 damage to you.
Center of the World Land — Forest :common: Center of the World is green. T: Add G to your mana pool. T: Regenerate target Green creature.
City of Prisms Legendary Land :rare: T: Add 1 to your mana pool. T: Add two mana of any one color to your mana pool. You lose two life.
Destruction's Lair Land :uncommon: When Destruction’s Lair enters the Battlefield, destroy a land of your choice. Then, choose an opponent, and destroy a land of that player’s choice. T: Add 1 to your mana pool.
Eastern Beach Land — Island :common: Eastern Beach is blue. T: Add U to your mana pool. T: Target Blue creature gains Flying until the end of the turn.
Flooded Pridelands Land :uncommon: T: Add W to your mana pool. T: Add G or U to your mana pool. Flooded Pridelands deals 1 damage to you.
Gravestone Peninsula Land :uncommon: T: Add U to your mana pool. T: Add W or B to your mana pool. Gravestone Peninsula deals 1 damage to you.
Halls of the Void Land :rare: When Halls of the Void comes enters the Battlefield, choose a creature type. You may choose not to Untap Halls of the Void during your Untap phase. T: Add 1 to your mana pool. T: While Halls of the Void remains tapped, creatures of the chosen type lose all abilities.
Lands of the Free Land :uncommon: T: Add R to your mana pool. T: Add W or U to your mana pool. You lose one life.
Mesa Bog Land :uncommon: T: Add W to your mana pool. T: Add B or R to your mana pool. You lose one life.
Northern Moor Land — Swamp :common: Northern Moor is black. T: Add B to your mana pool. T: Target Black creature gains Intimidate until the end of the turn.
Rolling Foothills Land :uncommon: T: Add G to your mana pool. T: Add W or R to your mana pool. Rolling Foothills deals 1 damage to you.
Southern Ridge Land — Mountain :common: Southern Ridge is red. T: Add R to your mana pool. T: Target Red creature gains Haste until the end of the turn.
Sun-lit Mire Land :uncommon: T: Add B to your mana pool. T: Add W or G to your mana pool. You lose one life.
Tropical Paradise Land :uncommon: T: Add U to your mana pool. T: Add R or G to your mana pool. You lose one life.
Western Fields Land — Plains :common: Western Fields is white. T: Add W to your mana pool. T: Target White creature gains First Strike until the end of the turn.
Wooded Highlands Land :uncommon: T: Add G to your mana pool. T: Add U or B to your mana pool. You lose one life.
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Icarael
0/0 Germ
Don't call it a comeback-- I've been here for years!
Posts: 33
Favorite Card: Coiling Oracle
Favorite Set: Ravnica: City of Guilds
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red
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Post by Icarael on Jul 11, 2018 7:33:05 GMT
Why do some of the dual lands have "You lose 1 life" and others have "[name] deals 1 damage to you"? Also, those trilands are strong. Too strong for uncommon, in fact. The original painlands entered untapped and tapped for or two colors for 1 damage, and they were widely played. If your lands ETBT, they'd be good at rare. Destruction's Lair-- Better worded as "When Destruction's Lair enters the battlefield, each player sacrifices a land." Uncommon land cycle-- They can lose the basic land types, otherwise they're stronger than a basic land.
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 11, 2018 13:34:50 GMT
Why do some of the dual lands have "You lose 1 life" and others have "[name] deals 1 damage to you"? Destruction's Lair-- Better worded as "When Destruction's Lair enters the battlefield, each player sacrifices a land." Uncommon land cycle-- They can lose the basic land types, otherwise they're stronger than a basic land. The Enemy Tri Colors have loss of life instead of damage because, when I made them, we figured there were plenty of ways around damage, but not loss of life. Just something to make a difference between the two types.
Destruction's Lair is worded that way specifically for multi player games. The max it will do is two lands, one of your choice, and then one of theirs. So, if you are playing a four person game, they might not choose you.
You're limited to four of them, as they aren't a "basic land", they just have the land types. Also, as they are considered to be colored, they are also vulnerable to effects that mess with colored permanents.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
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Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2018 19:48:30 GMT
How can something be black-bordered and give denimwalk?
No, wrong question. How can something be black-bordered and interact with silver-bordered cards? And why?
Still wrong question. How can something be black-bordered and make you tear cards apart AND be potentially fun?
ALSO besides those being colored and not real, tell me why shouldn't I remove four basic lands from my deck and put there four of your monocolor lands? Generally most of your lands are strictly better than basic lands, and that's not a good thing.
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Jul 11, 2018 19:52:23 GMT
is next.
Anger Elemental ) Out-of-colour ( ). Red generally doesn't do taps. It's also "[...]deals damage equal to its power[...]".
Atra ) Out-of-colour ( ). Red also doesn't get damage prevention of this sort.
Blazing Fury ) Is, not equals.
Dragon Fire ) This is what we call a "modal spell", and needs to be formatted as such: Modal spells are so called because they require you to pick a mode for the spell. All spells with Entwine are modal spells by default. (See the Comprehensive Rules section 700.2 for more information.)
Dragon Mistress ) Out-of-colour ( ). Red doesn't do indefinite yoinks, Brand notwithstanding; they're always temporary. This also seems to me to be a bit on the overpowered side. I would have the yoink last until EoT and have it be a variable-cost ability. Finally, up the rarity to Uncommon at the least, preferably rare. Entrancing Tutor ) Red doesn't get much in the way of tutors, and they generally are limited to Sorceries or tribal (which is almost always going to be on a creature). The one tutor I could find that wasn't restricted, Gamble, had a drawback (discarding a card at random immediately after the search).
Entwined Goblin ) Again, see my comments on Entwined Peddler et al.
Eternal Goblin ) Remove Persist or increase its toughness by 1. As writ Persist will insta-kill it and cause it to resurrect again due to Undying, meaning every death from an Undying resurrection will deal 2 damage (1 from the original death and 1 from the SBE kill caused by Persist) unless Persist is Stifled.
Flame Render ) Even with the limitation, Mogg Maniac suggests this card should be , especially since combat damage tends to be the most common sort of damage to creatures.
Flame's Embrace ) "[...]Target creature is unable to block[...]" -> "[...]Target creature can't block[...]"
Flaming Wings ) Colour bend - Red does not grant flying in and of itself unless it's granting draconic or phoenix abilities.
Licking Flame ) Inflame has the exact same effect for . You could cost this at .
The Mad Russian Lantrusian ) Let's try to avoid using real-world locations, hm? Also, "on the battlefield" does not need to be spelt out; creatures are only ever creatures on the battlefield and are creature cards everywhere else.
Summit Barbarian ) Needs to be .
Vengeful Alchemist ) Reword:
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 11, 2018 21:01:31 GMT
How can something be black-bordered and give denimwalk? No, wrong question. How can something be black-bordered and interact with silver-bordered cards? And why? Still wrong question. How can something be black-bordered and make you tear cards apart AND be potentially fun? Are you familiar with the card "Chaos Confetti" (apologies, not sure how to link to the cards)? As I've said earlier, this PW is based on a friend, who, during the Unglued heyday, had an Unglued deck, and proxied out Chaos Confetti. He actually even kept all the pieces in a baggies to show to people. His ultimate make him able to turn ANY card you own (I've corrected that as mentioned before) into a Chaos Confetti. Doesn't have to be in play. Hell, technically, I guess it wouldn't even have to be a Magic card. And to some, Chaos Confetti was LOTS of fun.
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 11, 2018 21:48:52 GMT
I guess a little backstory might help everyone to see where I was coming from with Nydex. First, as we can see, he is the Planeswalker for my friend, Phocus. Nydex is the leader of the Huccoons, a race of humanoid raccoons. Huccoons are, by nature, immune to fire. It will burn all of their hair off, but they are not harmed by it otherwise. Coincidently, they are all masters of making their hair grow by use of magical cantrips (D&D cantrips, not Magic cantrips). Nydex himself is a master of creating magical items, albeit twisted ones. His two greatest creations are the Hammer of Cod Piece Knocking and the Sword of Underwear Switching. This is why Nydex gives creatures Pro Red and Denimwalk. Pro Red for his immunity to fire and Denimwalk to somewhat represent his magical items.
The player he is based off of, Phocus, loves the Un sets, specifically Unglued. He still has his original “Cheese Stands Alone” deck. His love of the silver bordered cards created the second ability; getting a card you own (not from the deck, but your collection), and being able to play it.
As I’ve stated before, his ultimate ability was from Phocus’s deck running Chaos Confetti, and proxy-ing the card with commons when it came to using its ability. He collected every single piece he ever ripped apart, and kept them in a ziploc baggie.
Do these abilities twist Magic? Yes. Yes they do. I freely admit this. However, I don’t think they bend it to the breaking point. One card, a Mystic at that, out of a set that is “odd” is no more game breaking then one that says you can’t lose.
I hope this helps people understand where I care from when making this card. As always, I truly appreciate anyone who gives feedback on my set.
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Vunik
2/2 Zombie
Maybe trying to kill an immortal mage wasn't the best plan . . .
Posts: 110
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Black
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Post by Vunik on Jul 11, 2018 22:19:34 GMT
Do these abilities twist Magic? Yes. Yes they do. I freely admit this. However, I don’t think they bend it to the breaking point. One card, a Mystic at that, out of a set that is “odd” is no more game breaking then one that says you can’t lose. You're not twisting Magic, nor are you creating something even remotely comparable to any card that says "You can't lose the game". Why? Because as it stands, within black border, your card doesn't work. If you look through the Comprehensive Rules, you'll see that there are no rules relating to denimwalk, or to ripping up cards, or to referencing the border color of a card. All three of those abilities, and as such your planeswalker, can only exist in silver border, where the game is allowed to go outside of the confines of the Comp. Rules. It's why Unstable has cards that can go into players hands that didn't own them, despite that being literally impossible under the Comp. Rules. It's why Unhinged featured Little Girl, half mana, and half power/toughness. Because that's the only place it can work, period. There is no recourse. Honestly, it's not a question of whether you can justify the card or not, because nearly anything can be justified. It's that unless your entire set is in silver border, or even just this planeswalker (although that opens an entirely different can of worms), it doesn't work.
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 11, 2018 23:04:25 GMT
Rule number one. If a card’s text contradicts the rules as stated, the card text takes precedence. If you are basing everything off of the Comp Rules, then you are saying that no one can make new keywords, as the comp rules don’t cover them.
Also, the comp rules are fluid. They are ever changing. Things are only not covered by them until they are. If your only objection is that it can’t be done because it’s never been done that way before, then, to me, it is not a good argument as to why it CAN’T be done.
Also, the ripping of cards? That was originally done in an early tournament, by someone ripping his Chaos Orb into pieces, and throwing the pieces. Because it didn’t say he couldn’t do that. So, there is precedent.
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colinbeck
0/0 Germ
Posts: 11
Favorite Card: Clockspinning
Favorite Set: Time Spiral
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by colinbeck on Jul 12, 2018 0:30:25 GMT
You are asking players to destroy their physical possessions permanently for a mechanical advantage in a game.
Think for a moment.
Do you want to ask players to Destroy their own belongings to play your set? Do you expect people to WANT to play with your cards if this is the cost to play them?
You are designing for PLAYERS. Not for yourself. I don't care if you think its a good idea. I am telling you, your players will not agree. Shall we run a quick poll? We can set up a poll to see how many people think that Chaos Orb effects are fun to play in tournament settings.
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colinbeck
0/0 Germ
Posts: 11
Favorite Card: Clockspinning
Favorite Set: Time Spiral
Color Alignment: Blue, Red, Green
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Post by colinbeck on Jul 12, 2018 0:35:56 GMT
Also, "better than a basic land" means "I would replace 4 of my basic lands with this card in every case because it is strictly better." The colored permanent thing is #1) a memory issue because it either doesn't look like a land because its lacking the land border or it doesn't look colored because its lacking a colored border. This is especially important for lands, the backbone of every deck, and is a key reason that there is controversy around Dryad Arbor- It hides with the rest of your lands despite being mechanically different from them, so it is often difficult to remember it is a creature. Tournament organizers have specified exactly which printings and proxies are allowed because of this issue, so it is something to consider. And #2) it is in NO WAY enough of a downside to justify the fact that every deck every where almost no matter what will run your lands replacing 4 basics. Because they are strictly better. Imagine the cost and implications of every deck in every tournament ever wanting a playset of these lands.
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Post by Fleur on Jul 12, 2018 0:38:45 GMT
Arguably, the fact that Chaos Orb is banned in all formats is probably a sign that something that makes you use a card in a way that involves aim/dexterity is almost certainly out of bounds. After all, it is banned in all formats, which very few cards are (save for un-cards, ante cards (which involved legality issues re: gambling) and Shazharad, which resulted in obnoxious time stalling).
If I might make an argument for reasons why such mechanics would be unhealthy for the game even if the comp rules were to hypothetically allow it:
Denimwalk would disproportionately punish some people for game-unrelated things. Punishing a player for say, playing x deck or y deck is fine because that's something a play is expected to consider as it's within the bounds on the game. Punishing a player for something out of their control, such as having a limited wardrobe or having a preference towards certain types of clothing (especially the former), isn't IMO a place the game should go to. Granted, Unstable had Blurry Beeble, but Unstable was a significantly less competitive environment and was expected to be played as such, and so the expectations on what effects could do was different.
That is to say, by putting a card into a standard format, a card is expected to conform to the expectation of not being swayed by out-of-game factors. That's also why Chaos Orb is banned, which I reiterate again. Ultimately my dislike and disagreement with the inclusion of denimwalk and Chaos Confetti-esque effects doesn't come from the rules, but because there should be a separation between out-of-game and in-game, and as such one should not directly affect the other.
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Post by ZephyrPhantom on Jul 12, 2018 1:02:56 GMT
Take it from someone who's said stuff like this and seen a lot of other people make the same argument - "There is precedent" is a bad argument to use if you don't have an airtight case for why a controversial mechanic should be included in your set. Let's take a look at the Vintage banlist to start off. Keep in mind this is a format that is as close to "everything goes" as it gets in MTG. Aside from Conspiracies (which can't be regulated outside of Draft), the banned cards are either: 1) Cards that ask you to do things that are literally illegal. (Ante) 2) Cards that are "dexterity"-based, i.e. they rely on something not related to the player's inherent skill or their deck. (In Chaos Orb's case, arm strength - or the cleverness to rip it up) 3) Shahrazad. As Yoshi said, the issue with Denimwalk is that it punishes the player for something not related to Magic. This issue isn't just specific to jeans-wearing or ripping up cards; Mark Rosewater once stated in Kind Acts of Randomness that dice rolling was poorly received in older Un-sets because it disrupts the player's ability to control the outcomes of their game with just their cards. In other words, this is less a question of "Can I do it?" and more a question of " Should I do it?" Think of it like shoving something like Suspend onto a random mythic in Theros without reminder text and expecting people to just go along with it when it pops up in their booster pack. Sure, people may go along with it, but explaining why Suspend is okay in the block and how it interacts with everything is probably not going to end well. I get you're passionate about the character you're representing, but Planeswalkers still are cards within the set and as a result they need to respect whatever themes the set has.
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 12, 2018 1:09:08 GMT
As Yoshi said, the issue with Denimwalk is that it punishes the player for something not related to Magic. This issue isn't just specific to jeans-wearing or ripping up cards; Mark Rosewater once stated in Kind Acts of Randomness that dice rolling was poorly received in older Un-sets because it disrupts the player's ability to control the outcomes of their game with just their cards. In other words, this is less a question of "Can I do it?" and more a question of " Should I do it?" Fun fact. Denimwalk led to the making of one of my favorite rules in Magic. Removing your pants is faster then a mana source. In an Unglued tourney, someone was attacking with Hurloon Wrangler. His opponent literally stood up and pulls his pants off, and blocks. They call a judge, and the judge declares that its a legal move, as "removing his pants is faster then a mana source."
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Post by ZephyrPhantom on Jul 12, 2018 1:11:18 GMT
That's all well and good, but is this set an Un-set?
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Jul 12, 2018 5:03:21 GMT
As Yoshi said, the issue with Denimwalk is that it punishes the player for something not related to Magic. This issue isn't just specific to jeans-wearing or ripping up cards; Mark Rosewater once stated in Kind Acts of Randomness that dice rolling was poorly received in older Un-sets because it disrupts the player's ability to control the outcomes of their game with just their cards. In other words, this is less a question of "Can I do it?" and more a question of " Should I do it?" Fun fact. Denimwalk led to the making of one of my favorite rules in Magic. Removing your pants is faster then a mana source. In an Unglued tourney, someone was attacking with Hurloon Wrangler. His opponent literally stood up and pulls his pants off, and blocks. They call a judge, and the judge declares that its a legal move, as "removing his pants is faster then a mana source." Judge rulings for un-sets are irrelevant to black-bordered Magic. As everyone has been trying to tell you, there is a stark difference between the orderly and timely requirements of a black-bordered game/tournament and the anarchy and politicking of a silver-bordered game/tournament.
While there are silver-bordered cards that have made the leap ( Barren Glory/ The Cheese Stands Alone; Steamflogger Boss doesn't count) it's telling that pretty much no mechanics that ever appeared in a silver-bordered set have appeared or will appear in black border because they rely on characteristics not all players share or are quite clearly taking things to the point of self-parody. Not to mention that decency laws might actually forbid that trick you like so much, especially if a player goes commando.
(Also, the main reason Shahrazad is banned is because it stalls games out. This is also why all cards that create subgames since are in silver-bordered land.)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jul 12, 2018 6:59:24 GMT
101.1. Whenever a card’s text directly contradicts these rules, the card takes precedence. The card overrides only the rule that applies to that specific situation. The only exception is that a player can concede the game at any time (see rule 104.3a). Is there a rule for denimwalk in Magic's Comprehensive Rules? I don't think so. Furthermore, as others said, it would interact with things outside the game, which isn't allowed. But Magic rules don't say you can or cannot rip cards apart, so can I make cards be ripped apart? Well, no. Why? Look at the paragraph above. Also, saying ripping cards apart is precedent because some guy ripped his own Chaos Orb apart is the worst argument I've ever heard. Did you heard that action would be also illegal (in game terms) since it would lower your deck's card size and you would possibly, I repeat, possibly lose the game and possibly, I repeat, possibly get a warning? You say you made this PW for your friend that loves Chaos Confetti. I think you're lying. If you wouldn't, you would know that both Chaos Confetti, which makes you rip cards apart, and Hurloon Wrangler, which has denimwalk, as well as e.g. Border Guardian, which interacts with colors of borders, are SILVER-BORDERED. And silver-bordered means BANNED-IN-EVERY-COMPETITIVE-AND-SUPPORTED-FORMAT-POSSIBLE, that is a new word to learn. Having a random silver-bordered card in a black-bordered set isn't like having a random black-bordered card in a silver-bordered set, since silver-bordered sets are supposed to do whatever the fuck they want, and black-bordered sets are supposed to be played competitively. When you see silver borders you think "here comes trouble". Imagine Blacker Lotus printed in M19. That's like the same thing. Last thing, we don't try to discourage you from making this set. We're not even discouraging you from making that specific planeswalker. Shit, you can even put it into your black-bordered set, that's your choice! We just say what would be the players' response if your set would be printed for real.
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Jul 12, 2018 23:00:30 GMT
[...] Also, saying ripping cards apart is precedent because some guy ripped his own Chaos Orb apart is the worst argument I've ever heard. Did you heard that action would be also illegal (in game terms) since it would lower your deck's card size and you would possibly, I repeat, possibly lose the game and possibly, I repeat, possibly get a warning? [...]
I should also note that this is an urban legend, and it ended with the guy who ripped up his Chaos Orb being DQ'd for having an undersized deck.
If your main deck is undersized, that's not a warning, it's an automatic game loss for every game so long as your decklist does not match the contents of your deck and you don't correct it.
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 13, 2018 19:29:37 GMT
First, my apologies to anyone who I may have aggravated in my explanations. I tend to forget that the local meta-game isn't the same as elsewhere, so what could be fine here wouldn't fly elsewhere. Also, I tend to be a much more casual player, while my friend who helps me plays more in the tournaments. Because of this, we generally cover every all grounds for cards, but, as seen, not always.
Second, I truly appreciate everyone who has chimed in, giving suggestions or alternatives. As I've stated previously, this set has been in the works for the better part of 10 yrs. Some of the wordings were set before the current formatting was put into place. Also, I tend to word things for the Lowest Common Denominator, so I spell things out where it generally isn't needed. But, I then also forget key things that are very obvious. That's one of the reasons I have been posting things here. I tend to look at my cards and see what I meant, not what is actually written on the cards.
Thirdly... there is no third.
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Post by ZephyrPhantom on Jul 14, 2018 4:29:45 GMT
That's probably why this question was one of the very first things asked here, honestly:
Generally when someone says they're making a set here and doesn't provide much of a description people will inevitably trend towards the idea that the set is meant to be a serious set that has basic WoTC standards like being draftable or being capable of added to a format. A lot of the criticism has been made from that perspective because there's a very big difference between "a bunch of cards for my playgroup" and a "set", so to speak. (Though most of the cards bar Nydex could be rebalanced to the point this could be the start of a decent set. I like Jasmin post-rework in particular, Explosive Dragon would be an excellent monoR or 3GR card - monoGreen doesn't get flying that easily, etc...)
I am admittedly curious about the purpose of this set, specifically: - Is it meant to be drafted/sealed? - Is more like a compilation of cards you'd think might be interesting for people to use in a deck? - Can I play Constructed with this set alone?
=====
As for Nydex in particular: Hopefully this doesn't come off as beating the dead horse, but I think it's in your best interest to be clear about whether you're still taking input on changing him or not, or he's going to keep taking the focus off other cards people might be interested in using.
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 14, 2018 13:49:40 GMT
I honestly thought I had gone over what the set was previously, but in re-reading my comments, I guess I just thought about, and never did.
I originally set out to make it, essentially, a stand alone set that would be self contained. My plan from the outset was to make a full block, following the five PWs (all based of myself, my wife, and three friends) from this set, in three different forms; this set in a form that's close to their play style, the last set being something totally NOT their play style, and the middle being inbetween. This is why there are seemingly random things in the set. For example, Prophesised Demonslayer. There are only 3 Demons in this set. However, in one of the originally planned later sets, there were going to be more.
My friend who is helping me attempt to balance things, however, suggested I make things less self-contained, so it could easily be integrated into MtG, as if it were a real set being introduced. We went through a few variations of ideas. Originally, we weren't going to include "normal" creature types. The thought being was, for example, Zombies are already a good archetype deck, so they didn't need any additional cards. After a while, though, I went the other way with it.
From my perspective, it is meant more for play in a more "limited" format. At some point, after fine tuning how things work by itself, I would like to see how it interacts with the real sets. My plan was, after getting feedback here, to print out a few play sets of my cards, and have some friends build decks with just them. After a "tournament", I was going to get people's opinions. See what was too strong, not strong enough, what cards need to be cheaper, etc.
As for Nydex... I don't know what I'm going to do with that one. I will be doing SOMETHING. I just don't know what.
Again, thanks all. Sorry I've been a pain.
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Post by Jéské Couriano on Jul 15, 2018 10:27:06 GMT
A good plan, but in all honesty the best way to test to make sure that the cards aren't going to have unintended consequences would be to have them tested in a Modern environment. [Not to sound like I'm talking down, but to those who don't know, the Modern format allows only cards from 8th Edition onwards, excepting Conspiracies (which are illegal in all constructed formats as they require drafting). Everything from Invasion block and earlier is illegal in the format, except for cards reprinted in non-Vault sets in 8th Edition and beyond. --Bori]
Why Modern? Two reasons: First, it's one of the "eternal" formats, meaning cards can only ever be added to it, not removed from it (contrast Standard, which rotates out blocks regularly). Second, it's a far better barometer of how the colour pie and Wizards' design philosophies are nowadays than Legacy/Vintage will ever be.
Another option, though one I personally don't recommend unless your playgroup is into it, would be to test in Elder Dragon Highlander format. EDH is a singleton Commander format, meaning each deck needs to have a legendary creature and cards cannot have non-generic mana in their cost or rules text that's different from what that legendary creature has. (For example, a deck with Memnarch as commander can only use cards that have generic and/or blue mana in all of its casting costs and text boxen.) The reason I don't recommend EDH is because of the fact it is a singleton format; you'd ideally want to test if two copies of one card is problematic balance-wise.
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 20, 2018 21:56:59 GMT
Is there any chance one of you nice folks would continue critiquing the remaining portions of my set? I know things kinda hit a proverbial brick wall with Nydex, but I'd like feedback on the Gold, Multicolor, Artifact, and Land cards to take with me when I go to bounce ideas with my friend who is helping me. I've got print outs of the feedback to take with me, but I only have stuff up to Green. Thanks.
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Post by fluffydeathbringer on Jul 20, 2018 23:15:40 GMT
- Angelic Elemental: owner's* hand - wotc moved on from "creature or player" to "any target" a while ago (the new wording directly encompasses planeswalkers since the redirection rule no longer exists). it's your choice to do whatever kind of damage you want but I figured there's a chance you just don't know - Dreaded Angel: the two evasions are a bit redundant (and there's a reason WoTC phased out color-hate mechanics like Intimidate/landwalk/etc., there's too much variance in effectiveness against decks), suggest replacing intimidate with some other evergreen, say, deathtouch - Individuality is still needless and my solution would be to alter the grave effects of the legends themselves to not stack/not be that powerful, or just not have your legends have grave effects in the first place. any of these is better than "Legendary, but worse" - Hogmod's last ability needs to say that the player shuffles their library (there are way too many typos for me to comment on so I'm only picking the ones that actively glitch gameplay. if you want a more thorough typo cleanse I can review the set file) - see, Kitai's a good example of why Invididuality isn't really needed; its grave ability doesn't stack so self-mill doesn't make it obscene. suggestion: check out the Wonder cycle for good grave effect design for the legendary Incarnation cycle (an effect that doesn't stack with multiple copies), alternatively consider activated abilities of cards from graves like Nearheath Chaplain- why would I ever make Spectrum Fiend lose toughness. it'd be much simpler for it to be a 0/5. and why is there a five-color uncommon anyway, is there enough mana fixing to justify a five-color creature appearing in draft that often - Void Mask really doesn't need to be two-color, it can just be monoblue ( Merfolk Trickster) - Individuality is redundant (are you sensing a pattern yet) on Vrede and Zenkon; their abilities can't stack in the first place, since as legendary creatures you can have only one at a time
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 20, 2018 23:30:34 GMT
Yeah, need to look over Individuality again. We were worried more of having one in play AND one in the yard, more then having multiple in the yard. Maybe we just need something better worded.
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Post by fluffydeathbringer on Jul 21, 2018 1:17:11 GMT
- Dragon's Eye Visions is out of color in monogreen; "scry, then draw" is in blue's wheelhouse - Gorging Angel is out of color for both monowhite (the card draw) and monoblue (the lifegain), and shouldn't be a hybrid - planeswalkers have the Legendary subtype these days (also why is the planeswalker type of Jynx different from his name) - Jynx/Bill's (Jill's) +1 is way too good for his starting loyalty and mana cost (for modern WoTC sensibilities vis-a-vis walkers with buffing + abilities, see Jiang Yanggu and Arlinn Kord; if you want this to be a high-power set reminiscent of older Modern, Elspeth Tirel is still CMC4) - Masochistic Acolyte is out of color for monoblue (the creature ping) and monored (the card draw). hybrids need to be in-color for both of their colors - see above for Masochistic Genius - Necromantic Shaman: out of color for (the deathtouch) - Balance is white so Neo/Scott is also out of color (also because of the -3 increasing damage, which white doesn't do) - Sardia: mixing +1/+1 and -1/-1 counters is a bad idea because it creates confusion (at least in paper Magic) about which marker stands for which counter - Violet Enchantress: out of color for both colors (countering for , damage for ) - Serene Valley's text would not fit comfortably in the small textbox of a split card
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Post by fluffydeathbringer on Jul 21, 2018 2:10:40 GMT
- Arcane Empowerer: does "an opponent" mean "an opponent of the player who casts the spell" or "an opponent of you, the controller of the Familiar", also a 2/2 that stifles spellcasting like this is too strong for , and the 1 life on death isn't enough of a downside - Chimeric Belt: equipped creature to its owner's* hand; there's a simpler way to word the equip shenanigans and it's merging it into one ability: "Equip nonlegendary creature " - what's Thorn - Magical Bauble Stand: "+1/+1" isn't an ability so this shouldn't be worded like this. my suggestion is to just remove that bit. also bauble counters granting different abilities has that "which markers stand for which things" problem, only way worse
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 21, 2018 2:15:36 GMT
Thorn is a Keyword for the ability from Thorn Elemental. Specifically, "You may have this creature assign its combat damage as though it weren’t blocked."
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Post by fluffydeathbringer on Jul 21, 2018 2:23:33 GMT
yeah it was on the first page. my bad. but why would you devote an entire new keyword to a mechanic that only appears on two of your cards
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jynx316
2/2 Zombie
Luck? It's just a roll of the dice...
Posts: 107
Favorite Set: Urza's Saga or the entirety of Invasion Block
Color Alignment: White, Green
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Post by jynx316 on Jul 21, 2018 2:37:57 GMT
Goes back to the whole grand ideas I had for when I started out. I always wanted to keyword that ability, and did so when I first started. Had every intention of using it on more cards, but, as you see...
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