Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Sept 21, 2023 21:06:13 GMT
Li Kong, Sparkhunter    Legendary Planeswalker — Li   As long as Li Kong, Sparkhunter has no loyalty counters on him, he's a 4/4 creature in addition to his other types and not a planeswalker. Otherwise, damage not in excess of his loyalty isn't marked on him. (It still removes loyalty counters.)All damage Li deals moves loyalty counters to Li (instead of removing them if dealt to a planeswalker).  : Li deals 4 damage to any target.  : Each opponent sacrifices a planeswalker. Each player who doesn't sacrifices a permanent.  : You get an emblem with "Creatures you control get +1/+1 and have trample and trample over planeswalker." I left the -2 as a -2, instead of bumping it to a -3 so that Li Kong can turn themself into a creature on their own. |
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Post by Daij_Djan on Sept 21, 2023 21:33:13 GMT
Just for clarification: Yes, nothing happens on your second land as well as the forth or more ones..
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Post by serraphim on Sept 28, 2023 2:06:10 GMT
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Post by vizionarius on Oct 4, 2023 20:54:25 GMT
FeedbackIdea : Minor note on the static ability: Creatures only exist on the battlefield; anywhere else, it's a creature card, so it should be creature card to catch everything . I notice that your card doesn't "target" everywhere. I think it would be better to have it with both the 0 and the -12 abilities, to make it more interactable. Note on the 0 ability: Creatures can't be attached to anything. People usually place things in exile that are in some way tied to a specific permanent (like Oblivion Ring, for example) in a way that it seems like it's "attached," but it's really just a tool used to remember what's tied to what effect. Proposed wording that would work as you seem to intend, but with "target" added: "Exile target creature you control or target creature card in your graveyard, then create a 2/2 blue Illusion creature token with 'When this creature becomes the target of a spell or ability, sacrifice it.' When that token dies, return the exiled card to your hand." Regarding the effects, I think it's pretty neat. "Bottling" your creatures into 2/2 Illusions, then getting them back, netting loyalty counters in the process, is something that hasn't been done before. The ultimate is strong too, but it mostly feels OP with other cards that already do part of its effect (like Evacuation), so ultimately it doesn't seem too strong at all. Neat design overall. Flo00 : This is a pretty complex design, and I like it! Morph indeed is static, so checks out for the prompt. Sharkhan's switcharoo with a manifested creature is a nice addition to the effect. Even as a hard-cast, it feels good, and Sarkhan is the OG planeswalker with no + loyalty abilities. And your design sticks to that as well, since the static ability is kind of like an alternate way to "cast" him. Overall, I like this a lot. Reality Glitch : I don't think I fully follow the "Otherwise, damage not in excess of his loyalty isn't marked on him. (It still removes loyalty counters.)" part of your design... OK, looking back at the previous discussion about this, I think what's intended is essentially a replacement of him dying as a planeswalker, and instead becoming a creature. I think the cleanest way to do this would be through the use of "instead," like how regenerate uses it: "If ~ would be put into a graveyard, if he is a planeswalker [with 0 loyalty counters], he isn't. Instead, he becomes a 4/4 creature." The part in brackets can be added or removed based on if you want it to work against "destroy planeswalker" effects or not. Also, did you mean for all damage he deals to grant him loyalty abilities? If so, then his -2 would actually net him +2. Maybe it was supposed to be only combat damage? Or do you mean that if he deals damage to a planeswalker, then instead of just removing loyalty from that planeswalker, Li would transfer the loyalty onto himself? I will judge the design based on the following two assumptions: He becomes a creature if he would be destroyed while being a planeswalker, and he gains loyalty when he deals combat damage. I like the design. It's complex, but the intuition is there. Dealing 4 damage to any target seems pretty strong, especially since you get to do that, have an opponent attack it, then it becomes a 4/4 after, just so you can swing back with it and repeat the 4 damage to something else. On a turn when he is a creature and swings, he can do 8 damage. I think that's a lot, without much setup. Maybe having it be 2 damage? Or not be able to hit any target? The -4 effect is strong, since if you use it on turn 4 (or less with ramp), it could mean that you have a 4/4 creature and the opponent has lost a land or some early blocker. Thereafter, you attack and can rinse and repeat. I think it's a little too much with the "each player who doesn't, sacrifices a permanent." Maybe a nonland permanent? Even with that it's strong. The -6 is interesting since I don't see how it can be reached without some outside help through proliferating or pumping him while he is a creature. Since it takes some loops to get through, I think it would be made stronger than just +1/+1. Overall, it's an interesting design, but mostly because of the static abilities he has, which I like. I think his loyalty abilities could use less removal and more utility effects, to make him less of a menace, since his static abilities are just so strong. Daij_Djan : Love landfall on a Nissa! Also like that it limits to at most 2 loyalties a turn. Also nice that her static helps her -2. The -10 does need multiple turns, but even so, indestructible might be a little pushed. Maybe +3/+3 and trample would be enough. I don't have a lot of comments other than "I like this a lot." serraphim : Fun with poison! I like the static effect and the -1, but -2 seems a bit too much of a combo with her static. In a 4-player game, it can end up being a -2 to get +3. It just seems to feed the static too easily for my tastes. I like the vibe, but a -5 with some big effect would have been really neat. Overall a clean design, but a little lack-luster due to the -2.
ResultWinner is Daij_Djan with a really sweet Nissa variant that has a nice internal synergy without going too combo-y. Flo00 is runner-up. I hope nobody takes my longer feedback comments negatively, as that was definitely not the intent. A lot of complex designs/effects were attempted, and I'm always a fan of thinking about new design frontiers.
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Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Oct 4, 2023 23:21:13 GMT
I don't think I fully follow the "Otherwise, damage not in excess of his loyalty isn't marked on him. (It still removes loyalty counters.)" part of your design... OK, looking back at the previous discussion about this, I think what's intended is essentially a replacement of him dying as a planeswalker, and instead becoming a creature. I think the cleanest way to do this would be through the use of "instead," like how regenerate uses it: "If ~ would be put into a graveyard, if he is a planeswalker [with 0 loyalty counters], he isn't. Instead, he becomes a 4/4 creature." The part in brackets can be added or removed based on if you want it to work against "destroy planeswalker" effects or not. It’s not a replacement effect, though; it’s an infect-/wither-style “defines what damage does” effect. Each damage removes loyalty until it hits 0, turning Li into a creature, then the rest gets marked against their toughness. Also, did you mean for all damage he deals to grant him loyalty abilities? If so, then his -2 would actually net him +2. Maybe it was supposed to be only combat damage? Or do you mean that if he deals damage to a planeswalker, then instead of just removing loyalty from that planeswalker, Li would transfer the loyalty onto himself? The -2 was indeed meant to effectively be a +2 when used against any permanent with loyalty counters on it by replacing the removal of or lack of interaction with counters with the transfer of counters. have an opponent attack it, then it becomes a 4/4 after, just so you can swing back with it and repeat the 4 damage to something else. That actually gives control of when Li becomes a creature over to the opponent, so it’s not as guaranteed as you make it sound. On a turn when he is a creature and swings, he can do 8 damage. I think that's a lot, without much setup. Maybe having it be 2 damage? Or not be able to hit any target? I hadn’t considered the direct damage and combat damage happening in the same turn. I think I’d prefer the solution of adding  to the cost (or “If Li is untapped, you may tap him. When you do,” to the effect if nonloyalty costs on loyalty abilities is to exotic a design space). The -4 effect is strong, since if you use it on turn 4 (or less with ramp), it could mean that you have a 4/4 creature and the opponent has lost a land or some early blocker. Thereafter, you attack and can rinse and repeat. I think it's a little too much with the "each player who doesn't, sacrifices a permanent." Maybe a nonland permanent? Even with that it's strong. Hmm.... Either “nonland permanent” or “creature”. Though, I can see way a four-mana 4/4 with an E.t.B edict might be too strong. The -6 is interesting since I don't see how it can be reached without some outside help through proliferating or pumping him while he is a creature. Since it takes some loops to get through, I think it would be made stronger than just +1/+1. Starting loyalty of 4 means that one activation of the -2 on a planeswalker reaches the ultimate immediately, which is part of why I originally had it at -8. I had the idea for trample and/or trample over planeswalker, but that felt too powerful even for the -8, since it would be achievable by turn 6 without ramp. Overall, it's an interesting design, but mostly because of the static abilities he has, which I like. I think his loyalty abilities could use less removal and more utility effects, to make him less of a menace, since his static abilities are just so strong. It was a top-down design, hence the included story blurb, so the card being as much a menace as the character is intentional. |
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Post by vizionarius on Oct 5, 2023 2:13:05 GMT
Reality Glitch Ah ok, so my assumptions were wrong. The difficulty in your design idea is that damage is all dealt at once, and there are standard ways on how that's done, so to change how damage works will become very wordy and leave very little space on the card. Additionally, there is a significant change in the card during the process of how damage is dealt to him. These types of effects are much better handled through replacement effects. Infect and wither don't fundamentally change the fact that damage is done all at once, and they also don't lead to permanents changing types. Also, not only is how damage dealt to him is different, but how he deals damage is also quite complex. Since it seems like you want damage that he deals to planeswalkers to grant him the same amount of loyalty (but not to move over an additional damage's amount of loyalty), but damage he deals to nonplaneswalker permanents to still deal damage, but in addition to that, also move any loyalty counters on them onto himself. Having a better understanding on how you'd like your card to function, I think this would be one of the better ways to word it: Li Kong, Sparkhunter Legendary Planeswalker — Li If damage would reduce Li to 0 loyalty, instead, prevent the next X damage that would be dealt to him this turn, where X is equal to his loyalty, then remove all loyalty counters from him. He becomes a 4/4 creature. Li deals damage to planeswalkers in the form of moving loyalty counters from those planeswalkers onto himself. Damage dealt by Li to nonplaneswalker permanents also causes Li to move that many loyalty counters from that permanent onto himself. : Li deals 4 damage to any target. : Each opponent sacrifices a planeswalker. Each player who doesn't, sacrifices a permanent. : You get an emblem with "Creatures you control get +1/+1 and have trample and trample over planeswalker." I think here is where it's likely best to make some concessions in the design in favor of readability and templating with a minimal amount of gameplay changes. For instance, it is extremely rare for there to be nonplaneswalker permanents with loyalty counters on them. So I would leave that part of the effect out. Also, I'd ask: Why can't he just gain loyalty equal to the damage when he deals damage to planeswalkers? Why must it be a moving of loyalty onto him? Additionally, would it be OK to have him become a creature if he were to take lethal damage, and not have the remainder of the damage carry over? Sometimes the exact way to make a card work the way we intend will lead to very complex designs where there won't be enough space on the card for all of it. It's often beneficial to leave some corner cases out, or to make some allowances in how a card works in order to make it feel more intuitive or easier to template. Just my two cents, and of course feel free to ignore all of this. {I think this is very close to your design, with minimal concessions to effect and how he plays} Li Kong, Sparkhunter Legendary Planeswalker — Li If damage would reduce Li's loyalty to 0, instead, remove all damage and loyalty counters from him. For as long as he has 0 loyalty counters, Li becomes a 4/4 creature. Damage dealt by Li to planeswalkers also causes Li to get that many loyalty counters. : Li deals 4 damage to any target. : Each opponent sacrifices a planeswalker. Each player who doesn't, sacrifices a permanent. : You get an emblem with "Creatures you control get +1/+1 and have trample and trample over planeswalker."
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Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Oct 7, 2023 0:07:13 GMT
The difficulty in your design idea is that damage is all dealt at once, and there are standard ways on how that's done, so to change how damage works will become very wordy and leave very little space on the card. Additionally, there is a significant change in the card during the process of how damage is dealt to him. These types of effects are much better handled through replacement effects. Infect and wither don't fundamentally change the fact that damage is done all at once, and they also don't lead to permanents changing types. I was thinking along the same logic as how cards nowadays can refer to "excess damage", so I thought "damage in excess of <foobar>" would be a reasonable extension of that. If damage would reduce Li to 0 loyalty, instead, prevent the next X damage that would be dealt to him this turn, where X is equal to his loyalty, then remove all loyalty counters from him. He becomes a 4/4 creature. A) I deeply dislike that this prevents damage. As it has some wonky interactions with prevention prevention and effects that count how much damage is dealt. B) Even if I went with a prevention effect, I'd still have the "is a creature" effect sectioned off into a separate ability so that things that remove loyalty counters without dealing damage still flip the card into creature mode. For instance, it is extremely rare for there to be nonplaneswalker permanents with loyalty counters on them. So I would leave that part of the effect out. That was more for future proofing, since I've been toying with mechanics that care about loyalty counters on nonplaneswalkers, but I'm fine with leaving that out if I never get around to establishing that context. Also, I'd ask: Why can't he just gain loyalty equal to the damage when he deals damage to planeswalkers? Why must it be a moving of loyalty onto him? A mix of "It feels conceptually cleaner (even if more wordy)." and "Li can't get more loyalty than what's on the target." Additionally, would it be OK to have him become a creature if he were to take lethal damage, and not have the remainder of the damage carry over? That boost to resilience is probably fine. An alternative could be the "Gideon workaround" of using the indestructible keyword so it doesn't matter how much damage they take. (Might want to reduce the base toughness if I go with that latter case.) |
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Post by vizionarius on Oct 7, 2023 0:43:34 GMT
Reality GlitchAh! OK, some more clarity, thanks for explaining! My final wording using this thread. Happy to continue further in direct messages if you'd like. Don't want to take this thread away further: This way, he becomes a creature even when hitting 0 loyalty through not getting damaged, then returns into a planeswalker when he gains loyalty later on. His damage now moves counters onto him. This means that if a creature has loyalty counters, then he wouldn't do regular damage to that creature. I think this is the cleanest way to handle this, rather than separating how he does damage to planeswalkers vs non-planeswalkers (I don't think we want to double up on damage to planeswalkers by also moving loyalty in addition to the damage). I think loyaltied non-walkers are a rare enough situation where this is OK. I love these discussions. Thanks for going for it!
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Post by Daij_Djan on Oct 8, 2023 15:26:52 GMT
@ vizionarius: Big thanks for the win - glad you liked Nissa! 
You're not wrong about the ultimate - truth to be told it's the part of the card I'm least happy with as well. Without Indestructible it felt too weak, with it maybe too strong..
For your next challenge, let's try something unusual: Design a planeswalker card mentioning a planeswalker subtype different from its own! (for example, design a Jace planeswalker mentioning Liliana or similar)
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Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Oct 8, 2023 23:31:32 GMT
Will, Thoughtful Frostmage  Legendary Planeswalker — Will   When ~ enters the battlefield, you may search your library and/or graveyard for a card named Rowan, Fearless Sparkmage, reveal it, and put it into your hand. If you search your library this way, shuffle.  : Put a loyalty counter on each of a Rowan you control and a Will you control. : Tap up to two target creatures. They don’t untap during their controllers’ next untap step. Super miff’d they didn’t have Will as Rowan’s exclusive rare in the planeswalker decks, since that means they din’t have an equal number of appearances on cards. |
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Post by Idea on Oct 9, 2023 11:24:10 GMT
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Post by Flo00 on Oct 11, 2023 14:51:35 GMT
Remember the good old days when those two still liked each other? Will, Frosty Brother  Legendary Planeswalker - Will  : Tap up to one target creature. Its base power is 0 until your next turn.  : Activate a loyalty ability of target Rowan planeswalker you control by removing counters from Will rather from that planeswalker. : Draw two cards.  : You get an emblem with "You may cast instant and sorcery spells without paying their mana cost."  Rowan, Fiery Sister Legendary Planeswalker - Rowan : Goat up to one target creature. : Activate a loyalty ability of target Will planeswalker you control by removing counters from Rowan rather from that planeswalker.  : Rowan deals 2 damage to each of up to X targets.  : You get an emblem with "Whenever you cast an instant or sorcery spell, this emblem deals damage equal to its mana value to each opponent." The +1 ability should probably have some wording that works around the "only one loyalty ability per turn"-Rule. But then it would get way too wordy. Note that you can't use the combined counters, just the counters from the other. And if the ability goes plus, the targeted 'walker gets the counters. |
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Post by emberfire17 on Oct 11, 2023 21:44:35 GMT
  A perfect opportunity to make cards of my favorite gays |
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Post by lordpat on Oct 17, 2023 1:36:59 GMT
Nicol Bolas, the Unlikely Ally  Legendary Planeswalker - Bolas You may remove any number of loyalty counters from Jace, Liliana or Sarkhan planeswalkers you control as you cast this spell. Nicol Bolas enters with that many additional loyalty counters. : Return up to one creature card from your graveyard to your hand. If its a Dragon, each opponent loses 2 life and you gain 2 life.  : Look at the top three cards of your library, then put them back in any order. You may shuffle. Draw a card. : Search your library for a Dragon or planeswalker card, reveal it and put it onto the battlefield. Then shuffle. He might help you out juuuust a little bit. |
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Post by vizionarius on Oct 20, 2023 16:58:25 GMT
Garruk, Vengeful Hunter  Legendary Planeswalker - Garruk Whenever a Beast you control dies, Garruk deals 2 damage to each opponent and each Liliana Planeswalker your opponents control. : Create a 3/3 green Beast creature token. : Any number of Beasts you control each deal damage equal to their power to target creature you don't control. That creature deals damage equal to its power divided as its controller chooses among any number of those Beasts.  : You get an emblem with "Whenever a creature enters the battlefield under your control, it fights up to one target creature you don't control." Edit: changed to in cost.
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Post by Daij_Djan on Oct 29, 2023 23:49:55 GMT
Last call for entries - challenge will be judged on Tuesday after CotW and DC on Monday  |
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Post by Daij_Djan on Nov 5, 2023 20:58:27 GMT
OK, to get things going, I'll just announce the winner for tonight. Full judging to be added soon TM. For now, the win goes to.. emberfire17! |
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Post by emberfire17 on Nov 5, 2023 21:54:23 GMT
Thanks for the win! For the next challenge, make a planeswalker in one of the wedge color combos. |
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Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Nov 7, 2023 5:05:48 GMT
Zo’okh, Errant Knight  Legendary Planeswalker — Zo’okh Lifelink , Discard a card: Draw two cards, then discard a card.  : ~ deals 2 damage to any target. : For each creature, tap it and out a stun counter on it or untap it and it gains vigilance until end of turn. An ainok from a humanless plane of European high-fantasy, Zo’okh was trained as a cavalry archer and advanced scout for the Wolf’s Blood Empire, specializing in reconnaissance and enchanting his arrows as he notched them. Volunteering as a test subject for imperial wizards turned out disastrous as the arcane experiment flooded him with enough raw mana that the pain alone ignited his planeswalker spark. However, this also damaged his spark, now requiring tremendous amounts of mana from external sources each time he planeswalks and with no way to guarantee where he’ll end up next. Even with no sure way home, the unwillingly itinerant warrior never gave up; however, his return was met with two tragedies: he had outlived his beloved steed, and political upheaval since has seen the Empire carved up among the other major nations. I am aware that loyalty abilities haven’t been formatted like Zo’okh’s first one, but I felt it a reasonably safe innovation. |
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Post by Flo00 on Nov 7, 2023 17:12:51 GMT
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Post by Idea on Nov 10, 2023 11:13:18 GMT
 Soumaw, Soul Predator
Legendary Planeswalker - Soumaw
Exile target creature card in a graveyard, then investigate.
Until end of turn, Soumaw, Soul Predator becomes a copy of target creature card exiled with it. It’s still a planeswalker. Prevent all combat damage that would be dealt to Soumaw, Soul Predator until end of turn. If a creature that Soumaw, Soul Predator damage to this turn would die, exile it instead.
Gain control of any number of creatures that share a name with a card exiled with Soumaw, Soul Predator. Return any number of creature cards that share a name with a card exiled with Soumaw, Soul Predator from graveyards to the battlefield under your control. |
Soumaw is my character in the battleboards, a soul-consuming spell which gained a spark and sentience as a result, though its purpose as a spell remains ingrained as both its powers and its obsession. Was about time I made an updated version of it, so this challenge was a good opportunity. |
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Post by Daij_Djan on Nov 10, 2023 14:46:32 GMT
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Post by sdfkjgh on Nov 16, 2023 12:25:38 GMT
Jace and Vraska Legendary Planeswalker . Jace Vraska Whenever a creature dies, put a loyalty counter on Jace and Vraska. : Mill five cards, then return an instant or sorcery card from your graveyad to your hand. : You get an emblem with “Whenever you draw a card, destroy up to one target creature.” Legendary Planeswalker--Vraska Jace <- NOTE! This order is significant, and sexually suggestive. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) : Draw a card, then create a 0/0 black, green, and blue Illusion Assassin creature token with deathtouch, deathtouch for planeswalkers, “This creature gets +1/+1 for each card in your hand”, and “Whenever this creature deals damage to a player or planeswalker, draw a card.” : Destroy target nonland permanent, then return up to one target creature to its owner’s hand. : Target player mills forty cards, then their life total becomes equal to the number of cards in their library. |
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Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Dec 3, 2023 21:13:03 GMT
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Post by emberfire17 on Dec 4, 2023 22:05:27 GMT
Judging soon! Later this week.
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Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Dec 5, 2023 9:32:52 GMT
Judging soon! Later this week. Sounds sound. |
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Post by emberfire17 on Dec 9, 2023 1:53:37 GMT
Reality Glitch - I like the concept, it's very diverse and useful. I'd say 3 cmc is a bit low though, either it should cost more or start at a lower loyalty. Flo00 - Definitely overpowered, 4 creatures dying is a low bar for sultai and that ultimate ability is real mean for something that could potentially be activated on the same turn it enters. Idea - I'm always a fan of adaptable clones. The ult is strong, but it's balanced by the steep cost to get there. Daij_Djan - This feels like the picturesque mardu walker. I think a +2 to give a creature all three keywords is a bit strong, maybe it can be choose one of the three instead. sdfkjgh - This 100% feels like vraska and jace mashed together, I like it. Bonus points for funny name. Winner is Daij_Djan, with runner up Idea
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Reality Glitch
2/2 Zombie
Posts: 131
Color Alignment: White, Blue, Red, Green, Colorless
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Post by Reality Glitch on Dec 19, 2023 19:48:54 GMT
We might need third place announced if Daij_Djan or Idea don’t show. |
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Post by Idea on Dec 19, 2023 19:51:06 GMT
I am here if need be.
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Post by Daij_Djan on Dec 19, 2023 19:56:06 GMT
Sorry for the delay, I've been away last week for reasons. I'll have quite a few contests to catch up with judging and more - since I don't really have any specific challenge in mind for this one, I really wouldn't mind to pass this to Idea.
@ emberfire17: Big thanks for the win, though Yeah, looking back at my entry powering him down slightly indeed might be a good choice - like your suggestion! |
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"When in doubt, do a common." 
